First Strike vs. Strike: Combat Ends

Either I don't get it, or something isn't clear.

Rulebook 6.4.5 wrote: Combat Ends. This effect ends combat immediately. This type of strike is always the first to resolve, even before a strike done with first strike, and it ends combat before other strikes or other strike resolution effects are resolved. Combat ends is effective at any range. Combat ends is not affected by a dodge, since dodge only cancels effects that are directed at the dodging minion.

Majesty resolves before Aid from Bats. As Majesty skips to the end of combat, Aid from Bat's damage was never inflicted. You don't take these Carrion Crows damage.

Currently, S:CE resolves *before* any other non-dodge (well, these don't really resolve), non-first strike effect happens. And it skips that strike.

Coma isn't a S:CE. Theft of Vitae against a Shambling horde with 1 life isn't a S:CE. Fast Hands isn't a S:CE. Anesthetic Touch isn't a S:CE. Cards that read "Strike: combat ends [and ..]" are S:CEs.

Pascal Bertrand wrote: Either I don't get it, or something isn't clear.

Rulebook 6.4.5 wrote: Combat Ends. This effect ends combat immediately. This type of strike is always the first to resolve, even before a strike done with first strike, and it ends combat before other strikes or other strike resolution effects are resolved. Combat ends is effective at any range. Combat ends is not affected by a dodge, since dodge only cancels effects that are directed at the dodging minion.

This is the current state.

The "natural" change to get first strike beat S:CE is :

Rulebook 6.4.5 wrote: Combat Ends. This effect ends combat immediately. This type of strike is always the first to resolve, even before a strike done with first strike before strike that should resolve at the same time but after strike with first strike, and it ends combat before other non-first strike strikes or other strike resolution effects are resolved. Combat ends is effective at any range. Combat ends is not affected by a dodge, since dodge only cancels effects that are directed at the dodging minion.

I believe it's simpler if the change is :

Rulebook 6.4.5 wrote: Combat Ends. This effect ends combat immediately. This type of strike is always the first to resolve, even before a strike done with first strike, and it ends combat before other strikes or other strike resolution effects are resolved.. Other strike effect are resolved as normal, but combat end immediatly after their resolutions. Combat end have first strike if not otherwise precised. Combat ends is effective at any range. Combat ends is not affected by a dodge, since dodge only cancels effects that are directed at the dodging minion.

In essence, S:CE stop having a specific timing ; it resolve on the same timing as first strike. First strike is added to every S:CE by default, because without that S:CE are basically useless.

Ohlmann wrote: Other strike effect are resolved as normal, but combat end immediatly after their resolutions.

That part is not even required, except as a clarification, since it is just the default rule.

Ohlmann wrote: I believe it's simpler if the change is :

Rulebook 6.4.5 wrote: Combat Ends. This effect ends combat immediately. This type of strike is always the first to resolve, even before a strike done with first strike, and it ends combat before other strikes or other strike resolution effects are resolved.. Other strike effect are resolved as normal, but combat end immediatly after their resolutions. Combat end have first strike if not otherwise precised. Combat ends is effective at any range. Combat ends is not affected by a dodge, since dodge only cancels effects that are directed at the dodging minion.

In essence, S:CE stop having a specific timing ; it resolve on the same timing as first strike. First strike is added to every S:CE by default, because without that S:CE are basically useless.

I don't think current players would find it simpler to know that if you get punched for 1 agg, your majesty is useless. Or maybe they will, but they might think it's not that good an idea

Pascal Bertrand wrote: Well, anyone can feel free to try First Strke resolving pre-SCE.
Amongst other things I would highly recommend (in a competitive environment):
- Elimelech + Coma
- Muddled Vampire Hunter
- Quick Jab (Basilia, Samantha, Hector & Dogs of War, ..)

But if you do try it, please send me your feedback

I'm glad to see that a few people are offering to playtest the possible change. Elimelech + Coma would be devastating, of course, but he is an 11 cap, and Coma does cost 3 blood - and dodge would still beat it. And dodge or prevent would both beat MVH and Quick Jab agg. Elimelech sounds like he would become broken, but I think playtesting - especially where playtesters deliberately start including more dodge cards to adjust to the new meta - would have to determine that.