[Submission] Incitement

brandonsantacruz wrote: DOM for minion with 2 blood bleeds using incitement. Daring the Dawn makes the action unblockable by vampires. Command of the Beast and Conditioning gives another +4 bleed, for a total of 7. Bounce if you want, but this bleed is probably landing somewhere. My vampire would burn, but instead goes to the uncontrolled region. During my influence phase I pay 4 to bring them out again. Rinse and repeat.

Yeah, I hadn't even touched how strong the bonus effect on OT Incitement is. Seems superstrong.

Even without the torpor ability, currently good +2 bleed cards require disciplines. OT Incitement doesn't. This would be just flat out better than anything else. We need to tone this down considerably.

LivesByProxy wrote: Incitement
Requires an Anarch
Bleed at +1 bleed. If successful, put this card into play. While this card is in play, mortal allies get +X bleed, where X is their strength. Any Camarilla vampire can call a referendum to burn this card as a +2 stealth action.

I like this suggestion. This would enable a deck buing built around it without being obviously too strong or anything.

I like the +X bleed sugestion, although I feel it makes the card pretty powerful, specially because it requeres an enemy using actions to cancel it, and I don't think anarchs should have card so outright strong, but good cards that can be combined with other clans strengths.

To pitch a related idea along the line of "creating riots", what about this one?

Requires an Anarch
1 Blood
Bleed at +2 bleed. When this action is declared, you must choose a Mathuselah without an Initement in play, or this action fails. If this bleed is successful, put this card in play controlled by the chosen Mathuselah. At the start of that Mathuselah's unlock phase, that Mathuselah burns this card and 1 pool.

Now what the card does is gives you a very strong bleed against your prey, as the first bleed will mean burning 3 extra pools from him/her, but if you want to keep playing this card in a single turn, you are forced to harm others, as you cannot control the extend of the riot, which will make other players wary of your existence and maybe choose to take actions to stop this "anarchist nonsense", unless you choose to hurt yourself with your riot.

Bloodartist wrote:

brandonsantacruz wrote: DOM for minion with 2 blood bleeds using incitement. Daring the Dawn makes the action unblockable by vampires. Command of the Beast and Conditioning gives another +4 bleed, for a total of 7. Bounce if you want, but this bleed is probably landing somewhere. My vampire would burn, but instead goes to the uncontrolled region. During my influence phase I pay 4 to bring them out again. Rinse and repeat.

Yeah, I hadn't even touched how strong the bonus effect on OT Incitement is. Seems superstrong.

Even without the torpor ability, currently good +2 bleed cards require disciplines. OT Incitement doesn't. This would be just flat out better than anything else. We need to tone this down considerably.

Being anarch has a cost that is as high or greater than having a basic discipline, with the exception of some of the new anarch crypt cards. This usually means needing to dedicate a significant portion of your library and/or crypt to making anarchs.

If designers would only accept a tier 2 card, then it could read like this:

Incitement
Action
1 blood
Requires an anarch
bleed at +2 bleed.

Simple, gives some ousting power. I'd even consider removing the blood cost at that point because too many anarch cards require blood and there is still no Path.

I'm just concerned about future Anarch weenies they may print, and whether something like this would prohibit them. I like the idea of the card, the name, the Anarch requirement, the +bleed, even the part about preventing burning is neat. I'm just unsure about the numbers.

I also like Ratadin's suggestion.

brandonsantacruz wrote:
Being anarch has a cost that is as high or greater than having a basic discipline, with the exception of some of the new anarch crypt cards. This usually means needing to dedicate a significant portion of your library and/or crypt to making anarchs.

err... lolwut?

I don't know about you but here anarchs are everywhere since its so easy to make a deck anarch...

Bloodartist wrote:
err... lolwut?

I don't know about you but here anarchs are everywhere since its so easy to make a deck anarch...

As someone who has actually tried to play anarchs at the tournament level I don't think you understand how much of a handicap it can be to need to become an anarch.

What anarch decks are winning tournaments? Auspex malks with constant revolution/anarch revolt don't count, they are just a deck featuring anarch convert for better auspex wall options.

Making anarchs does not equal winning, it means getting to play the cards in your deck.