"...why proxies are not going to be allowed..."

Ohlmann wrote: How have the game survived the first total stop ?

People just played and didn't moan they wanted to be allowed to proxy Freak Drive and Parity Shifts at tournaments.

People just tried to enjoy the game for what it was instead of throwing around empty arguments about a "level playing field" or some other nonsense.

This is NOTHING compared to when it was DEAD dead.

Like..ashed and in Torpor with no signs of coming back to life.

I remember how over joyed I was when Sabbat War came into print and I bugged my mom to drive me a half hour to the store to buy a box.

People are fairly spoiled these days with their sense of entitlement. Sorry if this sounds like a "I walked up hill both ways to get back to school", because it's not. I'm only 30 and many spry years in me yet.

For casual play...print what you want. Who cares.

Play in organized tournaments where people put LOTS of effort into planning it, setting it up and then the players who spend hours and hours building and collecting decks......but Captain Printy at home or Mr.Inventive gets to go down to the print shop and dazzle up his own copies and expect and invitation?

For cards that the community errata without an option for re-prints. Sure. These should be allowed. Nothing else. (Though that could kill the value of the cards. More like a reduction in value as people will still seek out the real thing, so it would more or less knock it down a peg to a more realistic value. ie. Villein.)

Take some pride in your games.

You wanna play hockey, you gotta put on the skates.

I think what there is to say has mostly been covered on other threads. At this point, the decision rests with the VEKN leadership. For now, we'll try out these new cards on a new format. I don't know how many copies of Forgery and Bundi I have and would love to glue something decent over. IMO, VEKN should keep and open mind and if they don't do proxies of WW/WotC cards now, perhaps sometime in the future.

Izaak wrote:

Ohlmann wrote: How have the game survived the first total stop ?

People just played and didn't moan they wanted to be allowed to proxy Freak Drive and Parity Shifts at tournaments.

People just tried to enjoy the game for what it was instead of throwing around empty arguments about a "level playing field" or some other nonsense.

hmmm... One booster box for 5 us dollars... yep, even if I didn't have any Parity Shift, I would probably buy some boxes instead of complaining.
I think 5 dollar KoT boxes or Camarilla Edition boxes would keep many people from complaining too.
To ignore that is simply demagogic.

Availability is the issue.

Arthur Volts wrote: Play in organized tournaments where people put LOTS of effort into planning it, setting it up and then the players who spend hours and hours building and collecting decks......but Captain Printy at home or Mr.Inventive gets to go down to the print shop and dazzle up his own copies and expect and invitation?

Yeah. Net-decking is already annoying as it is though the one saving grace is that players actually have to get together the cards and build the physical deck. With print-on-demand, not only do you not have to come up with the idea (just copy it from the internet) but being able to simply print out every card for your deck? What's next? Outsourcing the playing as well? (Uh, I can't make that qualifier so I'll just have someone play in my name and qualify for me....)

Brum wrote: hmmm... One booster box for 5 us dollars... yep, even if I didn't have any Parity Shift, I would probably buy some boxes instead of complaining.
I think 5 dollar KoT boxes or Camarilla Edition boxes would keep many people from complaining too.
To ignore that is simply demagogic.

Availability is the issue.

Well, the $50 booster boxes weren't half that bad. And for the longest time, US players have been spoiled by $63 booster boxes (compared to what the Europeans pay, or what players of other CCG's pay in the U.S.).

People might point to the scarcity of KoT, but I wonder how that stacks up against the scarcity of Sabbat back when the game first fell into torpor. Does anyone still remember how hard it was to get Sabbat back in 1997-2000? How does that stack up to getting KoT nowadays?

Although you don't have $5 boxes now, active players do have much larger collections and tend to be more willing to give free commons and vampires to newbie players. You can also often get a good deal by buying someone's collection, who is leaving the game.