Suggestion for change to qualifier rules/status

etherial wrote: So, back in 2005, the only time I made it to GenCon, there were 50+ people in the NAC(?) and 14 people in the Shadow Twin. I didn't feel bad about not qualifying, since I hadn't planned on being there, and I ended up winning the Shadow Twin, but if these numbers are representative of most of the major tournaments, I wonder what the point is of having qualifiers at all.

Last year, there were 47 in the NAC (day 1) and 17 in the Shadow Twin. That's close to the most players ever, iirc.

The reason the qualifier system was created is three-fold:
1. It forces some level of competence in order to attend a "championship" event.
2. It keeps a "premier event" track visible for the game.
3. That's how that other CCG did it, and VTES copied a lot of what they did.

It wouldn't bother me personally if qualifiers were removed altogether and VTES focused on running more "normal" tournaments, but I doubt that the majority of players would agree with me.

KevinM wrote: My response to "Get a GW and qualify" is clear: Players could play a deck with which it is fairly easy to obtain a GW and then play improperly afterwards.

You do realize that, in a 10-player tournament, getting the GW in round1 is pretty much the same as making your way to the finals - especially if you learn that the other table has timed out with no GW.
That kind of situation probably happens a lot.

Now, where's the difference between "You know you're going to make it to the finals, and that -and only that- will be the game where you might get your qualification" and "you know you are qualified", when it comes to one's behaviour in rounds 2 / 3 ?
Perhaps, in the first option, you might want to eliminate potential final-threats.

I am curious to know whether it has ever occurred that someone earned 2 GWs in a large-ish 3 round event and has not qualified for a continental championship as a result.

Jeff Kuta wrote: I am curious to know whether it has ever occurred that someone earned 2 GWs in a large-ish 3 round event and has not qualified for a continental championship as a result.

I'm quite sure this never happened.

Let's consider "20" players a large event.
20 players is a maximum of 12 GWs.
In order to have a player with 2 GWs not qualified, we need that player to be after the 25% place.
That is, 6th or worse.
To have a player with 2 GWs 6th with 12 GWs means the 10 GWs go to the finalists.

I haven't checked the Archon (which would be required if you wanted an absolute answer), but I'm pretty sure the fact that
- all the GWs were taken
- noone had exactly 1GW
is something that never happened in a "large" tournament.

With 40 players (24 GWs), you want that player to be 11th or worse, wich means you need 20 GWs for the 10 first players, and you get 2 GWs loose (you could have 2 players with 2 GWs not qualified !)

However, if you take into consideration that ~20% - tends to be closer to30% these days - of the games don't get a GW, only 20 GWs are awarded, and your guy is qualified).


80 players - 60 GWs. (-20% => 48)
rank: 21st.
Total GWs needed "above": 40.
Total GWs loose: 16. ( => 6)

It gets more and more possible.



Anyways: this never happens. The 1GW limit is *around* 35%, in my experience (but of course, ymmv).

etherial wrote: *rolls grenade*

So, back in 2005, the only time I made it to GenCon, there were 50+ people in the NAC(?) and 14 people in the Shadow Twin. I didn't feel bad about not qualifying, since I hadn't planned on being there, and I ended up winning the Shadow Twin, but if these numbers are representative of most of the major tournaments, I wonder what the point is of having qualifiers at all.

You have a selection bias here: you have only counted the people who attended the event. There might be some players who would have liked to play the NAC, but failed to qualify beforehand and didn't want to travel without being sure.

I don't feel any changes that would make it easier to qualify to EC are needed. This is Championship Event after all and it should keep high level of competence it currently has. Winning tournament/ finishing in good place on ECQ/NC/ LCQ is, IMO very good requirement to take part in Championships. Otherwise it will become just an ordinary tournament